I've run into a snag on my first 6 string CBG build. I didn't have any problem with the headstock
offset of 15 degrees and the scarf joint, thanks to a previous poster who had pictures posted
of how it is done. B ut now...I have a tech issue that the FB will be on a horizontal 180 degree
plane and the acoustic homemade bridge that I plan to use is going to be too high for a
flat glued FB.
The typical neck offset on a Les Paul is about 4.5 degrees from the horizontal plane to allow
lower action when the "tuna-matic" bridge is installed.
I'm thinking of adding a sloped wedge of wood on top to create the 4 degree offset on the
FB that will allow a closer action.
Tags:
Hi again Mr. Carverman.
What's that weird thing you're using for a tail piece in this photo?
-Rand.
Thanks, Mungo. I must admit tho, I too learned it from someone here, so not completely my original.
One thing to note tho too, this drawing is using a laminated neck. You don't have to do that. sometimes I build with a single piece of 1x2 and an extra length on the bottom where the neck is inside the box. I glue that on, extending the 'tail' portion, cut a 2deg angle starting from the point where the neck enters the box, and then trim the tail thickness to 1" (.75"). Makes the tail and neck look the same thickness but if you looked inside, you would see the neck inside gets thinner from the neck side of the box to the tail side.
I might be able to diagram that too.
-WY
That bridge is very much looks a banjo bridge. I think you can find no end of discussion as to what shape and what material makes the best bridge, but your idea of lowering it would make things more simple to fit together.
Me thinks Carverman has built some string things before this CBG, but it is just spec.
Cheers Ron.
Hi Again.
I just re-read your original post and you say you are planning to use a "tuna-matic" bridge. No. I can't use the Gibson style tune-o-matic bridge on the CBG. It has the posts that anchor into
solid wood and also a bit wider than my 2 inch piece of neck block inside the CB.
What I was referring too..on my other builds of LP design, I did use commercial t-o-m and a stop
tail piece and it simplified construction and neck/string angle. In this CBG build, I've decided
to make a banjo style bridge instead.
If you are using this kind of bridge, then forget my comments above (I saw the picture of the classically designed bridge and made an assumption - not a safe thing to do).
Yes, the t-o-m bridge has 6 individual adjusters to set intonation..but having a movable bridger />
like the banjo style shown in my picture, you can position it on the top of the CB at the appropriate
scale point where its exactly the same measurement from the nut to the 12th fret and from the />
12 fret to where the bridge needs to be to achieve correct string intonation.
I once made one of these tunable bridges for a 4 stringer and found that it would require me to raise everything else (i.e. the fretboard) to maintain playable string height over the entire length of the neck. Mine was build on a little board about 1/4" thick. With the height of the mini bridges added in, it stood 7/8" off the board, which cause the string to rise off the neck at too high an angle such that beyond the 12 fret, the action was to objectionable.
Yes, and I try to avoid this by using a test line (fishing line) from the nut then touching the
bridge anddown to the end pin where the TP will be. This gives me a rough idea of
how much to sand down the banjo style bridge, and what the string angle will be with
the fret board just "tacked" in placetemporarily.
As you discovered..if the string angle is incorrect at the start, the CBG will be
next to useless to play beyond the first 3 to 5 frets.
So, I removed the bridge and used a "standard" one as I described earlier. If I do this again, I will glue the tracks to the soundboard to save 1/4" there and try to cut the height of the mini-bridges by 1/8" to 3/16". By the way, my mini-bridges were held in only by string tension.
I plan on doing the same, as movable style acoustic bridges shouldn't really be glued down.
Thanks. I wouldn't mind seeing a pic of yours. Every idea I get helps me with my build.
Even if the results from the first one are not what I expect, I will get a lot of experience
from that to pass onto my second build.
BR>
-Rand.
Rand Moore said:i>DIV>Hi Carverman,
The bridge you are planning to use has a nice "classical" shape, but is pretty tall in my book. Why not just cut off the legs?
Those "legs" were just there because when I cut out the bridge, I had no idea on FB angle or the
string height. They are now sanded down considerably.
Most of my CBG bridges I make are made of red oak and maybe 1/2 to 5/8 inches tall. The cross sectional shape is like a simple "house" made of a square and a triangle with slots cut for the strings through the "ridge of the roof" at appropriate locations. I think you'll get better (more) vibration transfer from your strings to the sound board (cigar box top) if the bridge is in full contact with the soundboard rather than standing up on legs.
Maybe you are right. I came up with the idea from an archtop violin bridge/banjo bridge, and
like any idea, it is subject to being modified as one goes along.
Any opposing arguments? It seems to me a lot simpler a solution to change the bridge than to change how the neck attaches to the box. Just my 2 cents worth.Well, most instrument designs can have ideas incorporated on both the neck attachment and the bridge
to arrive at a final workable solution.
The mortice&tenon Les Paul neck has about a 4.5 degee neck offset to allow closer string action.
The violin and acoustic guitars have a dovetail neck attachment at a particular angle as well.
Whether there is a "right way" or a "wrong way", maybe that is debatable, but the most elegant
solution is always desirable.
Dan
ok so one way to do this is to remove the neck -- assuming you didn't glue it and cut away some of the neck top where it is inside the box:
.
You might have to add on some reinforcement on the bottom. I will see if I can find the cleaner pic
-WY
BETTER ONE:
email me and I can send it to you.
Hello again Wes.
I reshaped the neck area where it enters the CB as per the drawing. The only question is
the "1/4 lid recess". Is the 1/8" thick plywood lid (which is hinged btw) supposed to be flush
with the FB or down into the recess slightly. I suppose I can figure it out trial and error,
but maybe a reply from an experienced builder would save me some test fittings in that
area.
In other words..if I temporarily tack down 1/4 " thick FB..is the surface of the lid supposed
to be flush?
Thanks,
Wes Yates said:ok so one way to do this is to remove the neck -- assuming you didn't glue it and cut away some of the neck top where it is inside the box:
.
You might have to add on some reinforcement on the bottom. I will see if I can find the cleaner pic
-WY
BETTER ONE:
email me and I can send it to you.
Ok, so your lid is 1/8" thick? Hmmmm. Most (not all) boxes are around 1/4" thick give-or-take. So you might have taken off too much then. You can add a 1/8" shim to bring the lid flush with the top of the neck. Then the fretboard will be flush with the lid. In reality I have a 1/32" gap between the fretboard and the lid so the lid will vibe and make more sound but that is up to you.
carverman said:Hello again Wes.
I reshaped the neck area where it enters the CB as per the drawing. The only question is
the "1/4 lid recess". Is the 1/8" thick plywood lid (which is hinged btw) supposed to be flush
with the FB or down into the recess slightly. I suppose I can figure it out trial and error,
but maybe a reply from an experienced builder would save me some test fittings in that
area.
In other words..if I temporarily tack down 1/4 " thick FB..is the surface of the lid supposed
to be flush?
Thanks,
Wes Yates said:ok so one way to do this is to remove the neck -- assuming you didn't glue it and cut away some of the neck top where it is inside the box:
.
You might have to add on some reinforcement on the bottom. I will see if I can find the cleaner pic
-WY
BETTER ONE:
email me and I can send it to you.
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