Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by The Capo Kid on March 12, 2014 at 9:40am

You'd have to take material off the underside of the neck in the box and what ever you took off you'd need to add to the block for the tail piece then you may have to alter the bridge , so I'd save a lot of work and make a new nut or shim it up and the same with the bridge , I allways make mine 2mm higher and sand down to get the action height , my last build was 1mm at nut and 2mm at 12th plays perfect but I did spend a lot of time on the frets .

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Permalink Reply by Richey Kay on March 12, 2014 at 9:57am

Good tips thanks. I'll give a higher bridge a go... wouldn't want the action any higher at the nut as it tends to sharpen the first few frets. If that doesn't work I might take some height off the bridge block. Maybe 2mm. So do you think the angle is too extreme? I don't level my frets. I have found that with a dead flat fretboard and pressed flat frets it doesn't cause too many problems. Thanks again.

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Permalink Reply by Jim Woods on March 12, 2014 at 10:11am

Ritchey,

I like a little angle in the neck to box as well.  It gives more room for the bridge & keeps a good break angle over the bridge.  You should be OK shimming up the bridge until you get the right action at the box end of the fretboard.  Sounds like you may want to lower the action at the nut.  Buzzes can be frustrating though, often I have found the culprit to be a flat spot on the saddle or nut, so I check with good downpressure w/ my fingernail at the edge of the break.

Nice looking CBG!

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Permalink Reply by Richey Kay on March 12, 2014 at 10:14am

Thanks Jim. no buzzes on open strings (as long as they're not plucked hard enough to strike frets) and the bridge has a sharp point. will try raising the bridge to see if that helps.

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Permalink Reply by David McQueen on March 12, 2014 at 10:33am

Keep raising your bridge. Also make sure your frets are all properly seated. A high fret will mess you around. You may have to dress a few. Once I get the correct bridge height, this is where I have been finding my problems with individual frets. II have been doing a fairly steep back angle, 1/2" over 10". I am ending up needing at least a 1/2" high bridge. I have finally drawn out a full size template to try to get some sort of measurement for different back angles for the bridge. Trying to get rid of the guessing for bridge hight

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Permalink Reply by turtlehead on March 13, 2014 at 11:59am

Hey Richey - I've done the angle on the last 4-5 builds or so and it's made a huge difference in action as you know.  I read somewhere about a 2 degree angle, so that's what I've tried to go for.  On my latest build I decided to go more in the 3-4 degree range and I ended up with a similar situation to yours.  Raised the bridge and all good, but bordering on too tall for my liking.  A little angle goes a long way from what I can tell.

I've also been using a zero fret and a scarfed headstock at about a 12-15 degree angle.  Combined with the 2 degree back angle, I've been getting good low action and no buzz without even thinking about dressing the frets, which I would consider only as a last resort.  The zero fret is the best part - no more fine tuning of the nut when it's time to string up and play. 

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Permalink Reply by The Phrygian Kid on March 13, 2014 at 2:15pm

I love it when a user addresses a question to the 'expert builders'...
I'd love to contribute, but lack the conceit :)

Ok sod it
I think you're definitely on the right track, maybe try shimming the bridge with a tiny bit of card etc, cos I think a millimeter or so will do the trick so long as your frets are all level

If the buzz is all the way up the neck and not open strings only then I fail to see what shimming or replacing the nut will achieve

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Permalink Reply by David McQueen on March 13, 2014 at 2:56pm

ROTFL... I'm not really qualified to tell if you are an expert or not... But I am pretty sure I'd take your "best guess" over some "considered opinions" on most days.

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Permalink Reply by Richey Kay on March 13, 2014 at 6:59pm

Well, you took the bait didn't you mate! I'm sure it was you I'd seen mentioning back angle before :)

So you don't think the angle is too extreme?

Thanks for all the replies guys!

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Permalink Reply by David McQueen on March 13, 2014 at 11:18pm

The back angle is there to get a better bridge height, giving a better break angle for the strings. It translates to a louder instrument for the same size. Look at violins and arch top guitars. They actually have to raise the fretboard off the boddy in some designs. Accoustic guitars originally built to be loud are arch top, originally North American and Selmer-Macaferri (Gypsy jazz) from Europe. Both are used with a separate tail piece. Selmer bridges are 9/16" to 11/16". I am getting just about that height with a 1/2" in 10" back angle. So, no, your back angle is not that extreme.

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Permalink Reply by Richey Kay on March 13, 2014 at 11:21pm

Cool, you learn something new every day!

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Permalink Reply by The Phrygian Kid on March 13, 2014 at 11:28pm

Right on, a square neck setting is a relatively new thing in lute instruments, piomeered primarily by Americans CF Martin and CL Fender, both of whom had new ideas about making the thing loud enough, but for centuries a big tall bridge with nicely spread feet was the ticket yep. Ps Ritchie your neck angles are nowhere near extreme yet mate, I've done plenty of bridges that are over an inch tall

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