Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Don Thompson on July 21, 2010 at 12:39am

http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/Electronics/Pots/i-4137.html

Not sure if this as been discussed on this thread as because of the amount of repetition I didn't read every post. The diagram shows how to wire a blend pot, which is the method I like to use for magnetic and piezo pickups. It will also work for different location PUs.
Don
http://www.electrocoustic.com/magpi.html
this is the way Wendler guitars are wired

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Permalink Reply by Jim Birmingham on July 21, 2010 at 2:07am

Thank you
Jim

Don Thompson said:

http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/Electronics/Pots/i-4137.html

Not sure if this as been discussed on this thread as because of the amount of repetition I didn't read every post. The diagram shows how to wire a blend pot, which is the method I like to use for magnetic and piezo pickups. It will also work for different location PUs.
Don
http://www.electrocoustic.com/magpi.html
this is the way Wendler guitars are wired

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Permalink Reply by Jim Birmingham on July 22, 2010 at 3:42am

Hi David,,,I found tha piezo unglued in the box. Upon reglueing I found the sound to be unacceptable, thin, and not at all full. I tried wiring 2 in series and paralell and made no headway at all. This guitar worked fine before I shipped it but I can't seem to get it back to that point again. I have had success in mounting the piezo in a block of wood and useing that as a bridge on top of the box. I suppose that is what I will do if you can't see something that I have done wrong.
Jim

David Lloyd said:

Hi Jim,

There is a discussion here http://www.cigarboxnation.com/forum/topics/the-benefits-of-double-p... I have read some people say wiring is series adds sound but also the very high impedance is increased further. I have tended to wire 2 or 3 in parallel as it lowers impedance and have been happy with the results. Sound appreciation is such a personal choice it is probably best try it both ways, by twisting the wires together and sticking to the CBG inside with tape so you can easily change it and see which you prefer.

The extra piezos means more transmitted sound (rubbing from the box against your body) but if you like to add a bit of soundboard percussion it could be seen as a plus.

You say you are after extra volume - what issue are you trying to solve? (once you start boosting the piezo output with a preamp for example the feedback kicks in if you try to boost the output too high).

Has the guitar being shipped back to you arrived yet? I am really interested in if you found any issues with it. One thought did occur to me was that some people have a too high an expectation of a piezo and assume they will act like a magnetic pickup. Whereas in reality you would never get an electroacoustic guitar player expecting an electroacoustic guitar with an undersaddle piezo/preamp to work with overdrive and sound good.

If you are after a "better" sound (as I said it is personal choice as to what sounds good) but I have in the past week bought a passive tone/volume control off ebay for around $9 that works well and comes with an under saddle piezo discussed here http://www.cigarboxnation.com/group/cbgwiringelectronics/forum/topi...

If this is what you are thinking of I can try to make a quick video clip so you can get an idea of what it sounds like.

Regards,
David

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Permalink Reply by David L. on July 22, 2010 at 6:33am

Hi Jim,

I guess I have been lucky with piezos so far as I haven't had problems like this.

Off the top of my head -

Are you still using the piezo you found in the box or is this a new one (not sure if rattling around in the mail within a box could have affected it eg partially pulling off a wire connection on the piezo)?

Do you have any test leads you can attach direct to the piezo with it in place so you can check if it is the piezo that is faulty or part of the 3 way circuit causing the problem?

Does the magnetic pickup sound ok?

Also are you able to attach a picture of the inside electronic circuit?

Regards,
David

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Permalink Reply by David L. on July 22, 2010 at 6:41am

Hi Jim I have just come across this on the internet http://www.prodigy-pro.com/diy/index.php?topic=34505.0 in short the person posting here is saying that piezo discs can have different polarities which when used together may give some signal cancellation. If you have the time and patience you could try matching different piezos to see if this improves anything.
I have put this info in the wiring and electronic groups to see if anyone there knows if you can check this with a simple multimeter.

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Permalink Reply by Jim Birmingham on July 22, 2010 at 9:45am

Hi David,,,I discarded the piezo that was in the bottom of the box. Then I tried a new piezo covering it with hot glue in a piece of oak. This is a method that I have used in the past. Also tried a couple other ways. I am now back to basics,,I am tapind a piezo to the inside of the box and if that works I will then cover that with a piece of oak and if that works iwill fill the block with hot glue. What I am doing is trying to see what has caused the problem.
David, Do you have any additional thoughts????
Jim

David Lloyd said:

Hi Jim,

I guess I have been lucky with piezos so far as I haven't had problems like this.

Off the top of my head -

Are you still using the piezo you found in the box or is this a new one (not sure if rattling around in the mail within a box could have affected it eg partially pulling off a wire connection on the piezo)?

Do you have any test leads you can attach direct to the piezo with it in place so you can check if it is the piezo that is faulty or part of the 3 way circuit causing the problem?

Does the magnetic pickup sound ok?

Also are you able to attach a picture of the inside electronic circuit?

Regards,
David

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Permalink Reply by David L. on July 22, 2010 at 9:54am

Hi Jim,

I would try connecting the piezo wires once it is in place directly to a amp cable plugged into the amp and then switch on and see how it sounds when all the other wiring in the circuit is bypassed - this will tell you if it is the piezo/position or something in the rest of the circuit that is at fault.

If the piezo checks out OK then any chance of a picture of the wiring in the box? (If you have trouble posting it here put it on your page)

Good luck,
David

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Permalink Reply by Jim Birmingham on July 23, 2010 at 9:03am

Hi David,,,Sorry for not getting back to you sooner,,This is my findings,,,The Humbucker was perfect all the time. The piezo was very thin sounding if it went thru the switch or was wired direct. I must have tried 20 different setups and nothing changed the thin sound of the piezo. After two full days of experimenting I decided to make a pocket in a piece of oak and mount it on top of the box with the bridge on top of the oak. Then Bingo,,,The piezo just come alive. I can use the tone knob with the piezo and go from twangy to full.
Jim

David Lloyd said:

Hi Jim,

I would try connecting the piezo wires once it is in place directly to a amp cable plugged into the amp and then switch on and see how it sounds when all the other wiring in the circuit is bypassed - this will tell you if it is the piezo/position or something in the rest of the circuit that is at fault.

If the piezo checks out OK then any chance of a picture of the wiring in the box? (If you have trouble posting it here put it on your page)

Good luck,
David

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Permalink Reply by David L. on July 23, 2010 at 10:12am

Hi Jim,

I am glad you solved the problem.

What are you planning to build next?

I am not sure what to do as I was going to make a cookie tin banjo but was recently enticed by ebay to buy six 3/4 sized violin projects and I want to convert at least one to a 4 string guitar and try spraying it with flip paint (the kind that changes colour depending upon the angle you see it from) because the bodies are so nicely contoured for this. Also I wanted to try making an 8 string guitar (like the bottom 8 strings of a 12 string guitar). Maybe I'll just stick these and other ideas I've got in a hat and pull them out one at a time.

Regards,
David

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Permalink Reply by Jim Birmingham on July 23, 2010 at 10:35am

Hi Dave, I am just about to finish up a 3 string guitar with double piezo's.

Say that violin 4 string really sounds interesting,,Do you have any pictures you could post??? I seen a 4 string violin/guitar in action,,might have been on youtube or possibly on ebay. That is really going to be sharp.
Jim

David Lloyd said:

Hi Jim,

I am glad you solved the problem.

What are you planning to build next?

I am not sure what to do as I was going to make a cookie tin banjo but was recently enticed by ebay to buy six 3/4 sized violin projects and I want to convert at least one to a 4 string guitar and try spraying it with flip paint (the kind that changes colour depending upon the angle you see it from) because the bodies are so nicely contoured for this. Also I wanted to try making an 8 string guitar (like the bottom 8 strings of a 12 string guitar). Maybe I'll just stick these and other ideas I've got in a hat and pull them out one at a time.

Regards,
David

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Permalink Reply by David L. on July 23, 2010 at 11:16am

Hi Jim,

I hope the piezos behave themselves this time.

So far I only have had a play with different strings on one of the violins (electric or classical guitar strings). I will post some pictures once I have made a proper start on it :O)

David

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Permalink Reply by Jim Birmingham on July 26, 2010 at 3:13pm

Hi David, I meant to ask you,,I see the picture of your piezo's inside the box but how did you actually mount them???If you try to play with alot of volume do they feed back???
Jim

David Lloyd said:

Hi Jim,

I hope the piezos behave themselves this time.

So far I only have had a play with different strings on one of the violins (electric or classical guitar strings). I will post some pictures once I have made a proper start on it :O)

David

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