Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Ron "Oily" Sprague on January 22, 2012 at 7:19pm

Frank,

 

Start with the naturally acoustic bits first: for heavy and gritty - longer scale length, heavier strings (3 wound guitar strings plus one bass strings, a la Johnny Lowe - but you knew that;-) ), bigger box to push more air. When you go electric, box air volume is not so important (unless you wanna play both amplified and non). For an electric build, many people have had success with stiff, thick sided boxes. Regular cigar boxes work too, as PM could attest.

 

But you asked about pickups. If you just wanna copy pat mAcdonald, then his box uses a John Lowe handmade pickup. You could probably get him to build you one (contact him here: http://www.facebook.com/people/John-Lowe/626866754), or purchase one from a CBN member (there are a number of people around CBN who build pickups: Ted Crocker - ad at right -, Skeesix - Skeesix CBG Pickups group here at CBN - , Bob Harrison - ad at right -, Elmar Klinghoffer - Klangbox Guitars...), or you can learn how to do one yourself at the CBG Wiring and Electronics group here at CBN.

 

Or you could get a cheap humbucker on eBay... 

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Permalink Reply by Frank Thomas on January 23, 2012 at 4:47am

Thanks for the advice Oily. I'd like to build my own pickups but the commercial options are a good back up plan. I agree iwth the other comments that finding that sound is a journey that you need to walk yourself but learning from you all that have already begun the walk is a part of that journey.

And with great respect to Johnny Lowe and the great work he has done in developing the lowebow I'd prefer to build my own instrument just cause I love to build things and enjoy the process. And I realize that he has deveoped a unique instrument that is very desireable and that anything that I build will not be a Lowbowe.

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Permalink Reply by Frank Thomas on January 23, 2012 at 4:55am

One other question Oily. I've seen a reference to a 27" scale. Is that typical? What would be a typical longer scale? Being a bass player, both electric and upright the longer scale is appealing to me. Thank you.

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Permalink Reply by Ron "Oily" Sprague on January 23, 2012 at 9:00pm

Frank,

 

I haven't built a bass box or Lowebow-style instrument yet (they are on the horizon, though.) I assume you've wandered over to the CBG Bass Group. The thing you have to balance is the guitar string versus bass string length, as well as the tension. Most wound git strings of my acquaintance are typically about 34-35" in total length; normally, about 31-32" of that is usable. The CBG bass guys seem to like scale lengths anywhere from 27" to 34". A VSL of 27" is about the same as that of a baritone guitar (which is often tuned an octave lower on standard guitar strings, and remember that a 4-string bass is often tuned the same way, just another octave or sometimes two, lower than that, that correspond to the 6th - 3rd strings on a standard guitar).

 

You could easily do a 30" scale Lowebowe-style instrument on a standard 9 x 7 x 2 1/2" cigar box. Anything longer, say 32- 34" VSL, I'd think you might want a bigger resonating chamber. Some people have glued 2 standard size boxes together; others have used wine crates, or even old suitcases, 5 L plastic water bottles, etc.The Kid and wes are right: just build something. Then do another one, applying what you learned from the first one. And so on.

 

You could always try and reverse-engineer a Lowebowe, but that seems like a lot of trouble and expense for a one-off. And I'm not actually suggesting it, because Johnny is rightfully proud ( and still somewhat protective) of his design; he should be able to trade on that.

 

And just to follow on with wes' statement, with which you seem to understand and agree: You're Frank, not PM (unless they've started doing musical DNA transplants while I wasn't looking). Try to sound like the best Frank you can. Honor your influences, but offer yourself. Honor and offer, all night long. >:-E 

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Permalink Reply by The Phrygian Kid on January 22, 2012 at 9:43pm

Noone gets it spot on first time. Also as any guitar player will tell you, there is no one sound..
Just do it. Learn something. Then do it again. And again

Have fun

Or...
Buy a lowebowe... Everyone copies em, but no one gets it right, theyre unique and Johnny's got lots of trade secrets

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Permalink Reply by Wes "I'm Baaaaack" Yates on January 23, 2012 at 3:43am

Well, first off, keep in mind these are cigar boxes. Meant to transport cigars. Nothing more. What we do to them is in essence -- magic. That is, we transform a simple, poorly built box into a musical instrument which is much like chicken salad from chicken sh... well.

You ain't gonna get Pat's sound without a little mojo. John Lowe makes them and its a trade secret as to how he builds and you aint'a'gonna get that secret. BUT... there is hope. as mentioned earlier, build and build again and use the tips mentioned.

PLUS, you have to understand, getting Pat's sound is 95% Pat, 5% his Lowebow, 5% his amp.

All in all, good luck.

-WY

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Permalink Reply by Frank Thomas on January 23, 2012 at 4:00pm

Thanks Wes. I like your magic statement. Several years ago I studied electric bass with a guy who was a wonderful player. We are sitting across from each other and I play this riff and he asks for my bass to show me a variation. He plays 2 notes and blows me away with the tone. I couldn't believe the tone he was getting out of MY bass. So yes, 95% of Pat's sound is Pat. But it gives me a goal and a way to label the direction I want to go.

So I am looking forward to the process and learning from the gang around here.

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Permalink Reply by Wes "I'm Baaaaack" Yates on January 24, 2012 at 1:44am

Oh dude, I built a 6 string with split humbuckers and such, and when I play it it sounds ok. But this summer I was at a festival selling and this damn 12 year old kid came in, plugged up my guitar and wailed off on some Jimmy Page. Could have sounded like it was from Houses of the Holy. Talk about blown away. This was off a cheap-ass VOX 5W amp too.

-WY

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Permalink Reply by ChickenboneJohn on January 23, 2012 at 3:54am

I don't think you can really plan it...that's half the fun seeing how they turn out.

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Permalink Reply by Cigar Box Nation on January 24, 2012 at 4:49am

Hahahaha!  Good luck!  I've helped Pat set up for shows and I've seen his rig.  The Lowebow cigar box guitar is only one small part of his sound (an integral part, yes...but still small in the whole scheme).  Not only does he split the signal out to two different channels, he's also running them thru several processors, various pedals he's road-tested and the bass even goes into a massive sub-woofer that takes two people to carry!  Melaniejane calls Pat a "sound chemist." 

Good luck!

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Permalink Reply by Frank Thomas on January 24, 2012 at 6:32am

Ow Well he is a pro isn't he. I didn't know how much gear but you've given some insight. And of course there's Pat. Appears to be an amazing musician. its not my intent to be pat. But I love the sound and the style. So it helps define a direction i want to go. And it will be redefined as I go many times.

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Permalink Reply by Hobo 63 on January 24, 2012 at 6:32am

I love Pinecone Fletcher sound.Just bought Fender Mustang 2.It have 8 Different amp modeling and allmost 30 ddifferent modeling.None of those are even close about that low muddy overdrive sound.I can modified sound with computer but...its not the guitar...not the modeling...not the overdrive...its all together and the player...

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