Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Mark on January 28, 2010 at 1:01am

Good luck with your film Lesley. I know it's hard work trying to make a name for yourself in that business because I have a friend who did the documentary course at Cardiff a few years back. But if you have the enthusiasm and skill and belief in your subject then I'm sure you'll go far.

If you're looking for opportunities to screen the finished film then maybe you should talk to Chickenbone John about having a showing at this year's Cigar Box Guitar Festival?

For me, this is about philosophy and politics as well as music - so I hope maybe your film will reflect some of the philosophical aspects of the CBG movement as well as the sounds. Like I said before, there are plenty of people here with much greater musical talent than I'll ever have, and they're your best bet for good footage. But I'm happy to talk about my personal philosophical take on it all (which, of course, is not necessarily the same as anyone else's philosophy).

My story is that, like others here, I discovered CBGs and their like partly as a result of seeing Seasick Steve. However that wasn't the start of my interest in unusual musical instruments - I actually began with an interest in quirky electronic music (and that probably grew out of an inclination to be interested in anything which defied convention). Things really picked up after I saw the 1994 documentary "Theremin: An Electronic Odyssey", which inspired me to build myself a Theremin. At the same time I was also into artists like Tom Waits and Captain Beefheart, so my mind was being opened to the leftfield end of bluesy guitar sounds (and I'd been into more traditional guitar music for many years - I was really into George Thorogood when he first made a big name for himself back in the early 80s). So liking Seasick Steve's sound wasn't a wild new direction in my tastes. The really radical think was that he eschewed any reverence for the manufacturing quality of instuments - it was the idea that if you can get a good sound out of something that's what counts. Perhaps also the idea of serendipity - that you can stumble on great sounds amidst junk and the way to do that is to let fortuitous happenstance guide you. I was looking on eBay to try to find a cheap old guitar that I could muck around with to see what sounds I could find. The first thing I discovered is that everyone who has a rubbishy old guitar now blindly believes it to be a vintage artefact from the era of original blues players and thus it's difficult to find one for less than stupid money. Then I saw an ad for something called a cigar box guitar, which puzzled me. Out of curiosity I did some Google searches and discovered a hidden world of improvised instrument making. I'm fairly practical and I have some engineering training so I realised this was something I could do. Building my first guitar was a revelatory experience - I was amazed at how good it sounded. I realised that here is a way for people to be able to make beautiful and distictive musical sounds while escaping from the plague of bullshit and brand worship that infests the world of conventional guitars. It's also in keeping with the idea that, if we're to look after the world a bit better, we need to get away from rampant, big-spending consumerism. It involves recycling and making the best of what you have - which is probably why it won't play so well to people who believe the secret to success in life (and economics) is all about spending shedloads of wonga on the latest fashionable gizmo.

(Here endeth the rant)

Permalink Reply by LeSaMilano on January 28, 2010 at 6:57am

Hey that sounds great Hogs -thank you-
I will contact you shortly :)

Lesley

HOGS GRUNT said:

Hi,
Sounds like a good project and an interesting one.
You can count me in for anything you need.
I am not much of a player, I'm a builder, but I have built several that my son, a talented guitarist, does sound bites for me. If you want anything from him or me we will be more than willing to contribute.
Let me know.

Hogs.

Permalink Reply by LeSaMilano on January 28, 2010 at 6:59am

Thanks oogi- I appreciate that!
I will contact you shortly.

Lesley

oogimacorly said:

hi lesley, i have a few vids/songs posted use what you want of them. cheers oogi

Permalink Reply by LeSaMilano on January 28, 2010 at 7:04am

Excellent rant Mark. Kudos. You aren't alone in this anti-corporate money- grubbing ...oh hang on, I'm not supposed to join in the rant! LOL ....I am to be objective. hmph.

thanks for you input - I really appreciate it. Great stuff.
Lesley


Mark aka. Junk Box Instruments said:

Good luck with your film Lesley. I know it's hard work trying to make a name for yourself in that business because I have a friend who did the documentary course at Cardiff a few years back. But if you have the enthusiasm and skill and belief in your subject then I'm sure you'll go far.

If you're looking for opportunities to screen the finished film then maybe you should talk to Chickenbone John about having a showing at this year's Cigar Box Guitar Festival?

For me, this is about philosophy and politics as well as music - so I hope maybe your film will reflect some of the philosophical aspects of the CBG movement as well as the sounds. Like I said before, there are plenty of people here with much greater musical talent than I'll ever have, and they're your best bet for good footage. But I'm happy to talk about my personal philosophical take on it all (which, of course, is not necessarily the same as anyone else's philosophy).

My story is that, like others here, I discovered CBGs and their like partly as a result of seeing Seasick Steve. However that wasn't the start of my interest in unusual musical instruments - I actually began with an interest in quirky electronic music (and that probably grew out of an inclination to be interested in anything which defied convention). Things really picked up after I saw the 1994 documentary "Theremin: An Electronic Odyssey", which inspired me to build myself a Theremin. At the same time I was also into artists like Tom Waits and Captain Beefheart, so my mind was being opened to the leftfield end of bluesy guitar sounds (and I'd been into more traditional guitar music for many years - I was really into George Thorogood when he first made a big name for himself back in the early 80s). So liking Seasick Steve's sound wasn't a wild new direction in my tastes. The really radical think was that he eschewed any reverence for the manufacturing quality of instuments - it was the idea that if you can get a good sound out of something that's what counts. Perhaps also the idea of serendipity - that you can stumble on great sounds amidst junk and the way to do that is to let fortuitous happenstance guide you. I was looking on eBay to try to find a cheap old guitar that I could muck around with to see what sounds I could find. The first thing I discovered is that everyone who has a rubbishy old guitar now blindly believes it to be a vintage artefact from the era of original blues players and thus it's difficult to find one for less than stupid money. Then I saw an ad for something called a cigar box guitar, which puzzled me. Out of curiosity I did some Google searches and discovered a hidden world of improvised instrument making. I'm fairly practical and I have some engineering training so I realised this was something I could do. Building my first guitar was a revelatory experience - I was amazed at how good it sounded. I realised that here is a way for people to be able to make beautiful and distictive musical sounds while escaping from the plague of bullshit and brand worship that infests the world of conventional guitars. It's also in keeping with the idea that, if we're to look after the world a bit better, we need to get away from rampant, big-spending consumerism. It involves recycling and making the best of what you have - which is probably why it won't play so well to people who believe the secret to success in life (and economics) is all about spending shedloads of wonga on the latest fashionable gizmo.

(Here endeth the rant)

Permalink Reply by smojo on January 28, 2010 at 8:38am

I got into CBGs about 4 years ago when I saw one on Ebay and thought it looked cool. I bought it, fell in love with it and being a practical/creative type thought it looked simple enought to build my own. Took firts one to work to show a colleague, he fell in love and bought it. Had to build another then. Most people who saw them loved them and if they were guitar players - wanted one.

For me it encompasses so many satisfying aspects. I love guitars in general so making my own seemed exciting. I love the creative elements involved - woodworking, artwork, writing about them, photographing them and I get a new toy to play with every time. I love using recycled stuff to make something useful and attractive and like Ben - sticking a finger up at the big manufacturers. I get a huge buzz when someone emails me to say how much they like my stuff. Makes it even more worthwhile. I like the people who are attracted to this stuff too. It makes me realise the world isn't totally made up of false, shallow, fashion-following, braindead people. There's still a place for individuality.

Permalink Reply by Roosterman on January 30, 2010 at 6:50am

Amen Smojo :o)

Permalink Reply by LeSaMilano on January 30, 2010 at 6:55am

It seems that 'eliminating the middle man' aka big manufacturers is a nice side-effect of this, too. Thanks for your input Smojo :)

smojo said:

I got into CBGs about 4 years ago when I saw one on Ebay and thought it looked cool. I bought it, fell in love with it and being a practical/creative type thought it looked simple enought to build my own. Took firts one to work to show a colleague, he fell in love and bought it. Had to build another then. Most people who saw them loved them and if they were guitar players - wanted one.

For me it encompasses so many satisfying aspects. I love guitars in general so making my own seemed exciting. I love the creative elements involved - woodworking, artwork, writing about them, photographing them and I get a new toy to play with every time. I love using recycled stuff to make something useful and attractive and like Ben - sticking a finger up at the big manufacturers. I get a huge buzz when someone emails me to say how much they like my stuff. Makes it even more worthwhile. I like the people who are attracted to this stuff too. It makes me realise the world isn't totally made up of false, shallow, fashion-following, braindead people. There's still a place for individuality.

Permalink Reply by Mark on January 30, 2010 at 10:51pm

Actually, I'm not anti-corporate or anti-money. I have no beef with large companies per se and certainly no problem with those that produce good products and contribute usefully to the world, nor do I object to people being rich if they've earned it. My disaffection is focused on something in individual humans that causes many of us to make frequent irrational judgements about what we do with our money. No one puts a gun to guitarists' heads and forces them to buy the latest Carlos Fandango superwhammy pickups or phlobotinum-plated bridge for their prized axe. Ultimately it's individual daftness that causes people to buy into the "look-at-the-sustain-on-that" bullshit and the myths that you get an "extra creamy" sound if your guitar is one of the rare Fenders with screws that do up counter-clockwise (BTW "extra creamy" is a term that should only be used in reference to ice cream or other dairy products). Of course, the daft consumerism rampant in the music business is fuelled by advertising and by myths and fashions that people spread amongst themselves - but we need to remember we're free to ignore it.

I confess I'm fallible but I'm trying and I'd like to think I can encourage others.




LeSaMilano said:

Excellent rant Mark. Kudos. You aren't alone in this anti-corporate money- grubbing ...oh hang on, I'm not supposed to join in the rant! LOL ....I am to be objective. hmph.

thanks for you input - I really appreciate it. Great stuff.
Lesley

Permalink Reply by Clive Palfrey on February 3, 2010 at 1:10pm

Helo Lesley, sounds like a mighty interesting project you are going on..You must contact Chickenboe John..
I became intersted in cigar box guitar making in....hold on ....cant quite remember .Certainly within the last year and certainly after seeing Seasick Steve on't telly.
I made my first guitar using a box from a painting set bought from Hobbycraft ,made the neck from bought hardwood , fitted frets made from a wire coathanger.Fitted a sink strainer as sound hole cover.Bought the cheapest strings i could find ,fitted them..... too short ,altered the neck length and ruined the intonation but it sounded great.Especially as I had fitted a cheap piezo pickup and electrified it .I HAD ACTUALLY MADE A MUSICAL INSTRUMENT even though I couldnt play it !!!
I then discovered the very first British Cigar Box Convention in Brum via Chickenbone John and Cigar Box Nation. Travelled up with my geetar in the boot of the car , ready for the plaudits .Was made to feel extremely welcome but was amazed by the standard of instruments brought there by founding members.
My invention stayed in the car..I have since upped my standard of making and my tally is up to 15 guitars / ukuleles..I now have a comprehensive selection of cigar boxes /tins etc..
To sum up I think the greatest pleasure is creating something you can play from almost nothing .Whittling the neck is fantastic .I use files and sand paper. The feeling is almost primeval and running your hands over a finished polished neck is almost erotic .....excuse me!
To be able to make an instrument is a beautiful feeling and if you have minimal tools and a modicum of skill anyone can do it ,believe me..
Good luck , Clive

Permalink Reply by LeSaMilano on February 3, 2010 at 7:58pm

Thanks for your input Clive - spent the day in Brum with Chickenbone yesterday - was a great interview plus he made a diddly bo in about 30 minutes and was literally playing it by the time I finished the interview. Fantastic stuff. I hope you're going to the next festival - and next time bring your creations *into* the place! haha Thanks for your commentary.

Lesley :)

Clive Palfrey said:

Helo Lesley, sounds like a mighty interesting project you are going on..You must contact Chickenboe John..
I became intersted in cigar box guitar making in....hold on ....cant quite remember .Certainly within the last year and certainly after seeing Seasick Steve on't telly.
I made my first guitar using a box from a painting set bought from Hobbycraft ,made the neck from bought hardwood , fitted frets made from a wire coathanger.Fitted a sink strainer as sound hole cover.Bought the cheapest strings i could find ,fitted them..... too short ,altered the neck length and ruined the intonation but it sounded great.Especially as I had fitted a cheap piezo pickup and electrified it .I HAD ACTUALLY MADE A MUSICAL INSTRUMENT even though I couldnt play it !!!
I then discovered the very first British Cigar Box Convention in Brum via Chickenbone John and Cigar Box Nation. Travelled up with my geetar in the boot of the car , ready for the plaudits .Was made to feel extremely welcome but was amazed by the standard of instruments brought there by founding members.
My invention stayed in the car..I have since upped my standard of making and my tally is up to 15 guitars / ukuleles..I now have a comprehensive selection of cigar boxes /tins etc..
To sum up I think the greatest pleasure is creating something you can play from almost nothing .Whittling the neck is fantastic .I use files and sand paper. The feeling is almost primeval and running your hands over a finished polished neck is almost erotic .....excuse me!
To be able to make an instrument is a beautiful feeling and if you have minimal tools and a modicum of skill anyone can do it ,believe me..
Good luck , Clive

Permalink Reply by MrRandomWritings (Backwater Bri) on February 3, 2010 at 9:21pm

Hi dear, looks as though you are getting a lot of support here - I would expect no less of course! Some good comments and ideas flowing around. Especially like the fact that folk here aren't guitar bores (Mark to name but one!) or trying to be rock Gods as that always put me off playing in public - the oiks who come up and tell you they have an okey cokey brain blaster at home while you try to hide your cheap strat copy and keep the bugger in tune!

Permalink Reply by ChickenboneJohn on February 3, 2010 at 9:36pm

Hi Lesley,

I hope the footage is of some use...and hope that I wasn't too rambling. It must have been a long day for you traveling up from Devon. The filming was a new experience for me, and an enjoyable one at that. It was quite a challenge to quickly put together a guitar on camera, but I managed it..hardly my finest hour, but at least I know it can be done and you got it in the can.

Regards

John

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