Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by HENRY LOWMAN on April 22, 2010 at 4:42pm

I LIKE that idea! :-)

Ben said:

How about both? I'm building a 5-string banjo that's got 4 tuners on the head, like normal but uses a tuner at the tail for the 5th string. It keeps the neck profile streamlined, but you still get that short drone string.

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Permalink Reply by David Canizaro on April 23, 2010 at 1:45am

Anyone got pics of the tuners in the cigar box? Sounds like a neat idea!

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Permalink Reply by Fergus Morris on April 23, 2010 at 6:34am

This is how I did it. This method is maybe a bit inelegant as there is a gaping hole at the back of the box. It can be done more elegantly I am sure.....

David Canizaro said:

Anyone got pics of the tuners in the cigar box? Sounds like a neat idea!

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Permalink Reply by Wichita Sam on April 23, 2010 at 6:49am

just to see if I could..... too much hassle for my taste in the building and in the tuning.... MichaelS said:

If you stuff the tuners inside the box it makes a very compact guitar, great for traveling. I don't know who but someone in here has done it this way.

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Permalink Reply by Wichita Sam on April 23, 2010 at 6:52am

purely prototyping... but could be done David Canizaro said:

Anyone got pics of the tuners in the cigar box? Sounds like a neat idea!

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Permalink Reply by Tracy Kennedy on May 6, 2010 at 2:21pm

Well OK then...is this far fetched?

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Permalink Reply by Wichita Sam on May 6, 2010 at 2:25pm

How are you going to handle the string spacing.....
Tracy Kennedy said:

Well OK then...is this far fetched?

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Permalink Reply by Rand Moore on February 13, 2014 at 4:15pm

Using three separate tuners instead of a 1x3 would allow you to space the strings closer together, but watch out to make sure you have enough room that the tuner knobs are free enough to turn without interfering with each other. Also you want to drop the tuners down deeper into the box so the string holes sit lower and so the break angle of the strings over the bridge will be a sharper angle. Did you complete the build? How did it turn out, Tracy? Maybe I'll try this sometime.

-Rand.

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Permalink Reply by Tracy Kennedy on February 14, 2014 at 8:32am

I'm still around Jim. I just don't frequent as much I used too. Rand, yes yes and yes you are correct. That example was a "let's see if I can do it" thing for this thread. One of the others built one pictured on this there'd and admitted to hacking the box up. I just tried to do it to see if it could be done without butchering the box and to see if my approach was viable. I never completed the build. It's still sits on the bench as you see it in the picture above.... Covered in dust. Along with all the other builds I was in the middle of when life decided to get in the way of my build time. I miss building them and I'll get back to it someday when life decides to slow down

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Permalink Reply by Rand Moore on February 15, 2014 at 12:23am

Hi Tracy,

At first glance, your method of installing the tuners looks super simple, but when you get down to actually doing it, the process is fairly difficult. Mounting the 3 tuners on the block of wood is not hard, but when you go to mount that board with the tuners into the cigar box, then you realize that you have to disassemble the 3 tuners so than you can drill 3 more holes in the side of the cigar box where the tail piece usually attaches. You need to make one hole per tuner knob, and then you have to reassemble the tuners with the 3 tuner knobs oriented so that their shafts go though the side of the cigar box while the board with the tuner base plates and shaft is in place, and then you have to put on the gears and screw in the 3 little screws. And all the holes and all the parts have to line-up perfectly. I also see in your photo that you had to drill 3 more holes in the back board so you could stick in your screw driver to tighten the gear screws. IMHO this method is just too tough.

However, I have started building a headless CBG using a modified version of your approach. In my approach, I cut out a piece of wood in the back side (tail-end) of the box through which the tuner knobs can easily pass. This makes the installation process much simpler. The other difference in my design is that my tuners have the string hole mid-way up the shaft (because they are the only ones I have in stock... I usually build instruments with slotted headstocks). So, my tuners are mounted a bit higher than yours and the shafts stick up even higher (not a good thing... maybe next time I'll saw off the excess part of the tuner shafts... the metal shafts are not that hard to cut with a hack saw). Instead of a standard "neck-thru", or "neck-almost-thru" neck attachment, I have run a board the same diameter and thickness of the neck down the bottom of the box and I secure the neck to this board via 3 wood screws to avoid having the neck come into the area used by the 3 tuners.

I still have to cut and glue on the sound board which will be 2mm thick plywood veneer (the cigar box top was too thick) and I need to fret the fretboard, both of which I'll do tomorrow. I have been taking some photos, so I will upload some to let you see how I did it. The photos should illustrate much of what I said via text above.

In re-reading this thread, I guess my approach is similar to the "gaping hole at the back of the box" approach used by Fergus Morris and for which you were trying to figure a work-around... the one you refer to as "hacking the box up". Well, I think a gaping hole "hack" is the most practical way, but sure if you have the skill and patience your method could be done.

-Rand

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Permalink Reply by Rand Moore on February 15, 2014 at 12:39am

The other thing about my headless design compared to the way I usually build instruments (with either a slotted headstock or a scarf joint and two side pieces (wings)) is that it is easier to build. This is especially true because while in China all I have available are hand-tools. I have put my Cigar Box Banjo project on hold because I'm having problems cleanly cutting the two "wings" for the scarf joined flat headstock (I keep screwing them up when trying to saw straight and square lines) and because I need to practice cutting a simple 4-lobed banjo head using a coping saw. Will get back to it soon. I'm thinking of using softer wood for the wings and only cut in the softer wood for the 4-lobed banjo headstock.

I'll have to check the balance of the instrument once I have finished constructing it.

-Rand.

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Permalink Reply by Tracy Kennedy on May 6, 2010 at 2:33pm

Heck I havent gotten that far yet Sam. I just did it 15 minutes ago to see if I could do it without hacking the box up. I suppose some sort of string tree between the tuner and the bridge would be the best option.

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