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Permalink Reply by Gitarmoro on February 5, 2010 at 11:22am

(see picture)

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Permalink Reply by Wes "I'm Baaaaack" Yates on February 5, 2010 at 11:47am

If it were me, I would chose the Romeo e Julietta, followed by the Ramon Allones. Not because of graphics, tho they are nice. The ReJ might make a deeper sounding guitar. The Ramon would be my next tho I've seen the Java boxes quite often. The others might be ok, and mostly good for solid/electric types.

One question to ask: are the lids cardboard or wood (pressed wood or plywood)? Both are ok, but one makes a more muted sound in my opinion. You might be able to tell if one you can warp with your hands, it might be the cardboard. Wood (plywood) is much stiffer. I usually can't warp the lid.

this is _my_ opinion only tho. Others will give better opinions.

-WY

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Permalink Reply by Wes "I'm Baaaaack" Yates on February 5, 2010 at 11:53am

Oh some of the all wood boxes might be thick too. -WY

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Permalink Reply by Gitarmoro on February 5, 2010 at 12:09pm

Thanks, Wes! Exactly my choice, too. The lids are all superstiff (thus making them plywood?). Is that a good or bad thing (I think even Gretsch make plywood tops these days :))

Wes Yates said:

If it were me, I would chose the Romeo e Julietta, followed by the Ramon Allones. Not because of graphics, tho they are nice. The ReJ might make a deeper sounding guitar. The Ramon would be my next tho I've seen the Java boxes quite often. The others might be ok, and mostly good for solid/electric types.

One question to ask: are the lids cardboard or wood (pressed wood or plywood)? Both are ok, but one makes a more muted sound in my opinion. You might be able to tell if one you can warp with your hands, it might be the cardboard. Wood (plywood) is much stiffer. I usually can't warp the lid.

this is _my_ opinion only tho. Others will give better opinions.

-WY

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Permalink Reply by Wes "I'm Baaaaack" Yates on February 5, 2010 at 12:25pm

The lid then should be more of a wood or plywood. Its hard to tell (unless you have used the box before.) Macanudo's are 'wood" and blue Punch boxes are pressed wood (cardboard) Most should be 6mm-8mm thick (~1/4" in US).

Also I am understanding now that the back is just as important as the front -- the back resonates as well making a deeper, more resonant sound. Keep this in mind when you build or play.

-WY

Gitarmoro said:

Thanks, Wes! Exactly my choice, too. The lids are all superstiff (thus making them plywood?). Is that a good or bad thing (I think even Gretsch make plywood tops these days :))

Wes Yates said:

If it were me, I would chose the Romeo e Julietta, followed by the Ramon Allones. Not because of graphics, tho they are nice. The ReJ might make a deeper sounding guitar. The Ramon would be my next tho I've seen the Java boxes quite often. The others might be ok, and mostly good for solid/electric types.

One question to ask: are the lids cardboard or wood (pressed wood or plywood)? Both are ok, but one makes a more muted sound in my opinion. You might be able to tell if one you can warp with your hands, it might be the cardboard. Wood (plywood) is much stiffer. I usually can't warp the lid.

this is _my_ opinion only tho. Others will give better opinions.

-WY

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Permalink Reply by Outhouse Instruments on February 5, 2010 at 3:47pm

Remember, the whole box resonates, so all wood is important.
The deeper the better, just because of interior volume.
The bigger the better, but thin isn't good for acoustic and might sound thin and tinny even amped.
I would go with the same order as Wes.

Matt

btw- the RyJ's usually have a presswood lid ( the ones I have are ) but the still (typically ) sound very good.

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Permalink Reply by Wes "I'm Baaaaack" Yates on February 5, 2010 at 4:13pm

Again, Matt is quite correct! Thanks Matt.

-WY

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Permalink Reply by Wichita Sam on February 5, 2010 at 4:57pm

Gitarmoro,

Remembering that this is your first build.... I wouldn't build on the R&J unless you're building a bass... the relatively short length of the box will make some design elements more problematic.... (also, R&J lids are often a heavy paste board, they can still sound good, but not wood...check by scratching away the paper from the inside of the lid),

Of the others, (assuming you want to consider acoustic properties) the Griffin is too thin, The Java's top is to heavy (you can build on the bottom, but these are also often pasteboard), the Zino appears to be hinged on the narrow dimension which make it a little ackward looking, and with the rounded edge complicating the build. (I do like Zinos, they generally have high quality wood tops)...

I guess that leaves the Ramon Allones... It is the only brand that I haven't built on, but if it is a typical paper covered wood box (with a paper hinge) that it appears to be, it looks like a great "starter" cigar box, that will be relatively simple to build with easy dimensions to lay out a CBG and enough size to make a good sounding CBG....

If you are building a CBG that is only going to be played as an electric, most of these issues are not so important. If you care about acoustic properties then they are important....

"No rules" say follow your nose or your gut or the stars. But after 200 builds, I don't like overly thick boxes, because they are ackward to hold, I don't like excessively thin boxes, because they lack resonance. Some of the best boxes are plain paper covered boxes often making great players while being simple to build on.

Let us know what you decide and definately how it comes out....

the best,

Wichita Sam

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Permalink Reply by Gitarmoro on February 6, 2010 at 3:56am

Wichita Sam said:

Gitarmoro,

I guess that leaves the Ramon Allones... It is the only brand that I haven't built on, but if it is a typical paper covered wood box (with a paper hinge) that it appears to be, it looks like a great "starter" cigar box, that will be relatively simple to build with easy dimensions to lay out a CBG and enough size to make a good sounding CBG....


"No rules" say follow your nose or your gut or the stars. But after 200 builds, I don't like overly thick boxes, because they are ackward to hold, I don't like excessively thin boxes, because they lack resonance. Some of the best boxes are plain paper covered boxes often making great players while being simple to build on.

Let us know what you decide and definately how it comes out....

Wichita Sam

Thank You Wichita Sam! Now I'm undecided again. :D
As for the Zino box: Isn't it an option to just remove or just replace the front hinge and just finish the neck inside the box, thus allowing the housing to rest the proper way and avoiding the rounded edge challenge? My worries towards that one was rather the lack of size.....

I'll definately let You know. Thanks again.

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Permalink Reply by Wichita Sam on February 6, 2010 at 5:14am

Yes, you can remove hinges and clasp on the Zino.... Then the question is fastening it. Some builders glue, but I like access to the inside should something go wrong...... You could set corner braces and screw the two parts together....

the best,

Wichita Sam

Gitarmoro said:

Wichita Sam said:

Gitarmoro,

I guess that leaves the Ramon Allones... It is the only brand that I haven't built on, but if it is a typical paper covered wood box (with a paper hinge) that it appears to be, it looks like a great "starter" cigar box, that will be relatively simple to build with easy dimensions to lay out a CBG and enough size to make a good sounding CBG....


"No rules" say follow your nose or your gut or the stars. But after 200 builds, I don't like overly thick boxes, because they are ackward to hold, I don't like excessively thin boxes, because they lack resonance. Some of the best boxes are plain paper covered boxes often making great players while being simple to build on.

Let us know what you decide and definately how it comes out....

Wichita Sam

Thank You Wichita Sam! Now I'm undecided again. :D
As for the Zino box: Isn't it an option to just remove or just replace the front hinge and just finish the neck inside the box, thus allowing the housing to rest the proper way and avoiding the rounded edge challenge? My worries towards that one was rather the lack of size.....

I'll definately let You know. Thanks again.

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Permalink Reply by Gitarmoro on February 13, 2010 at 8:51am

OK, here's the update: I actually ended up using a (nonpictured) Montecristo box. Finished the thing 2nite and much to my surprise it sounds pretty cool - both acusticly and amplified. Me not being a woodworker i fell into quite a few pitfalls but it ended up pretty well nontheless. Bit of luck and art by accident, but i love the little s***er and can't quite stop strummin it.

I took some pictures along the way. For anyone interrested they are here:
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=190937&id=731915019&l...

Oh, and this forum i really immaculate for the not-so-able :D

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