Do I have to spend $300 to own a good wood plane? I'm trying my hand at making cbgs; I have 15 boxes, and I have 4 necks that are ready for some shaping. My goal is to make really nice looking necks (radiused, shaped, fretted, fret markers, etc). I'm prepared to spend a little money, but I don't want to be ridiculous about it. I'd like to make an informed decision if possible.
I don't know the difference between a $20 Stanley and $300 Lie-Nielson....
Any suggestions for someone that wants reasonably priced tools that will allow him to do good work?
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Before I was building CBGs I was building bamboo fly rods. There is a lot of very precise planning involved with tolerances of a few thousandths of an inch being critical. I bought a pair of well used Stanley planes Ebay for under $30 and they worked just fine.
I did find the blade was as important if not more important that the plane. I bought a Hoch blade that made a huge difference in the planing process. Of course it actually cost more than the planes but it was worth it.
Some of the newer Stanleys have Hoch type blades and if I had to do it over again I probably would have gone with a new Stanley.
I just can't imagine anything in cigar box guitar building justifying the cost of a Lie-Nielson plane unless you just really like top of the line tools and don't mind paying top dollar to get them.
Hi Jim - bamboo fly rods? That's really interesting! Would like to hear more about your experience with those. Well, I received my two old Stanley planes the other day. Not only are they nice to look at, they work great! Will have to look into Hoch blades. Thanks for adding to the conversation!
Jim Saraceno > Richard WilkinsJuly 9, 2016 at 8:44am
Yeah, my fly shop is a great hangout place and one day a buddy of mine said "Bill and I are going to build a bamboo fly rod this winter, want to join us?" And of course, I hopped right on that. At our first meeting I asked "So just how do you build a bamboo fly rod?" and the answer was "We don't know, we haven't red the book yet." So I got a book and every week we would read a chapter, discuss it and try things out. By spring we each had a very fishable rod.
I made 4 others after that, I kept three, sold two others for cost of material and now I have all the bamboo rods I need. I'm kind of doing the same thing with cigar box guitars, built a couple, built a few more and sold them for cost of material (so I could practice on someone else's guitar). The difference being after three rods for myself, I had all the rods I wanted but after six guitars for myself (acoustic, electric, acoustic/piezo, fretless, a beater for camping trips, and a resonator) I still have many things I want to try so I know I won't be stopping after a dozen builds.
If you're talking about shaping the back of the neck a plane isn't really needed. It would be used for flattening the fretting surface. Here's how I shape necks using inexpensive hand tools mostly from yard sales with the exception of the Dragon rasp from Stewart McDonald.
When it comes to necks, you are better off getting a really nice rasp. I now have a collection of rasps and I can shape the back of a neck in about 30-35 minutes including sanding. This doesn't include the time for the transition area where the neck blends in to the peg head because I do a portion of that on a spindle sander. As far as planes go, I got a very nice Wood River #4 plane from Woodcraft and it was about $160. I got a cheap plane from Home Depot or Lowes and it works just fine. You also might want to think about making your own plane and just buy the iron.
what you need to do is search ebay for a "vintage Stanley 9 1/2" block plane...find one that someone has restored in the 50 dollar range...they are about 40 to 60 years old and cut better than anything you will buy in a store! ....there is a whole group of old men who restore them and sell them cheap...take advantage of this!..way better than the new ones made in China
if you buy the Stanley 9 1/4 it is just as good as the 1/2 but does not have an adjustable mouth...they can be had for about 20 to 30 bucks! the LieNielson are great...but yes they are 300 bucks,...get a vintage American one on ebay...look for a Vintage Crarfstman too!...they can be had for less than 40 bucks...they key is you want a "9 1/2" block plane...its not 9 inches, thats just the No, it is all you will ever need!
to me it is the only shaping tool you really need besides a rasp, get a vintage one, spend time on ebay looking thru the restored vintage ones, they can be had cheap because most people do not want them....But you will cherish it if you take the time to find a good USA made one...plus it can be had really cheap!....50 to 60 bucks at most!..it will last several lifetimes...trust me on this. Watch this video and get right with Stanley!
Thanks for the tip! I'm looking at a 1950s no.4 Bailey smoothing plane for $59 right now. Are you familiar with this plane? Will look for the 9-1/2 too...
John McNair > Richard WilkinsJune 30, 2016 at 7:13pm
I went and looked, No thats a jack or 2 handed plane..It could be a great tool, but will mostly like be a large paper weight, unless you plan on making doors!
these below are just suggestions...you need to stay up one night and look through the gazzilion planes they have on ebay..
you need a "small Block plane"
Not a low profile ( unless you want to shave the box lid) or very thin shavings...
also you don't want a 2 handed plane...thats for large areas of work
before you buy it now or bid....reference it on google and make sure it is not LOW ANGLE...otherwise you will not do much with it.....you need a small block plane, or hand plane!
check thru some of the 2nd name brands from the 50's ...like Sears, or others, you can get a plane for under 40 bucks like new....sharp and still in the box!
you need a one hand block plane...I will look and add a few ideas here
with just one plane an old school 9 1/2 with the adjustable moth, you can build a guitar...or a house!....no other plane will you need to buy unless you want another plane.... a 9 1/4 is good if you are a new woodworker and don't want to figure out how to set it up...i like 9 and 1/4 cuz they are dime a dozen and work like a million bucks!...but if you have the time and money, get a real 9 1/2 it is all you ever need to build guitars.
I'm going to pick a nit here for a moment. The #4 is a smoothing plane. It's for putting the final finished surface on a piece of work. I use mine (a type 9, built around 1902-07) on all kinds of projects. The #5 is the jack plane (usually the first plane that touches the surface.) Read every gory detail on this site: http://www.supertool.com/StanleyBG/stan0a.html
Now, I totally agree with Beetlejuice that a vintage plane is the way to go. Sure, the Lie-Neilsen tools are great, but they come with that hefty price tag (way out of my range.) Use the above link to read about the years you want to look for. Bench planes (which could easily radius a fretboard) were best before WWII. Block planes (which will also be fine at that job as well as many smaller tasks) were good for a little longer. Usually, you can tell by the paint job (again, reference the site above.) I'd get the adjustable mouth on the block plane (either 9 1/2 or 16) as that lets you take a really fine shaving.
Patrick (yet again, the link above) sells vintage tools. If you drop him a line and tell him your budget and needs, he'll probably have one on hand.
Replies
Before I was building CBGs I was building bamboo fly rods. There is a lot of very precise planning involved with tolerances of a few thousandths of an inch being critical. I bought a pair of well used Stanley planes Ebay for under $30 and they worked just fine.
I did find the blade was as important if not more important that the plane. I bought a Hoch blade that made a huge difference in the planing process. Of course it actually cost more than the planes but it was worth it.
Some of the newer Stanleys have Hoch type blades and if I had to do it over again I probably would have gone with a new Stanley.
I just can't imagine anything in cigar box guitar building justifying the cost of a Lie-Nielson plane unless you just really like top of the line tools and don't mind paying top dollar to get them.
Yeah, my fly shop is a great hangout place and one day a buddy of mine said "Bill and I are going to build a bamboo fly rod this winter, want to join us?" And of course, I hopped right on that. At our first meeting I asked "So just how do you build a bamboo fly rod?" and the answer was "We don't know, we haven't red the book yet." So I got a book and every week we would read a chapter, discuss it and try things out. By spring we each had a very fishable rod.
I made 4 others after that, I kept three, sold two others for cost of material and now I have all the bamboo rods I need. I'm kind of doing the same thing with cigar box guitars, built a couple, built a few more and sold them for cost of material (so I could practice on someone else's guitar). The difference being after three rods for myself, I had all the rods I wanted but after six guitars for myself (acoustic, electric, acoustic/piezo, fretless, a beater for camping trips, and a resonator) I still have many things I want to try so I know I won't be stopping after a dozen builds.
If you're talking about shaping the back of the neck a plane isn't really needed. It would be used for flattening the fretting surface. Here's how I shape necks using inexpensive hand tools mostly from yard sales with the exception of the Dragon rasp from Stewart McDonald.
https://youtu.be/TsgUdEOCwPM
There are specialty plane makers who make works of art that are tools you would be proud to hand down to your grandkids.
I have one of this bloke's spokeshaves ans it is gorgeous and a perfect finishing tool.
http://www.hntgordon.com.au/gidgee-bench-planes.html
When it comes to necks, you are better off getting a really nice rasp. I now have a collection of rasps and I can shape the back of a neck in about 30-35 minutes including sanding. This doesn't include the time for the transition area where the neck blends in to the peg head because I do a portion of that on a spindle sander. As far as planes go, I got a very nice Wood River #4 plane from Woodcraft and it was about $160. I got a cheap plane from Home Depot or Lowes and it works just fine. You also might want to think about making your own plane and just buy the iron.
BUY A VINTAGE AMERICAN MADE STANLEY!!!!
what you need to do is search ebay for a "vintage Stanley 9 1/2" block plane...find one that someone has restored in the 50 dollar range...they are about 40 to 60 years old and cut better than anything you will buy in a store! ....there is a whole group of old men who restore them and sell them cheap...take advantage of this!..way better than the new ones made in China
if you buy the Stanley 9 1/4 it is just as good as the 1/2 but does not have an adjustable mouth...they can be had for about 20 to 30 bucks! the LieNielson are great...but yes they are 300 bucks,...get a vintage American one on ebay...look for a Vintage Crarfstman too!...they can be had for less than 40 bucks...they key is you want a "9 1/2" block plane...its not 9 inches, thats just the No, it is all you will ever need!
to me it is the only shaping tool you really need besides a rasp, get a vintage one, spend time on ebay looking thru the restored vintage ones, they can be had cheap because most people do not want them....But you will cherish it if you take the time to find a good USA made one...plus it can be had really cheap!....50 to 60 bucks at most!..it will last several lifetimes...trust me on this. Watch this video and get right with Stanley!
I went and looked, No thats a jack or 2 handed plane..It could be a great tool, but will mostly like be a large paper weight, unless you plan on making doors!
these below are just suggestions...you need to stay up one night and look through the gazzilion planes they have on ebay..
you need a "small Block plane"
Not a low profile ( unless you want to shave the box lid) or very thin shavings...
also you don't want a 2 handed plane...thats for large areas of work
before you buy it now or bid....reference it on google and make sure it is not LOW ANGLE...otherwise you will not do much with it.....you need a small block plane, or hand plane!
check thru some of the 2nd name brands from the 50's ...like Sears, or others, you can get a plane for under 40 bucks like new....sharp and still in the box!
you need a one hand block plane...I will look and add a few ideas here
<p>http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-STANLEY-9-1-4-BLOCK-PLANE-...
here is an off brand,
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-6-1-2-Stanley-Defiance-Block-Plane-...
with just one plane an old school 9 1/2 with the adjustable moth, you can build a guitar...or a house!....no other plane will you need to buy unless you want another plane.... a 9 1/4 is good if you are a new woodworker and don't want to figure out how to set it up...i like 9 and 1/4 cuz they are dime a dozen and work like a million bucks!...but if you have the time and money, get a real 9 1/2 it is all you ever need to build guitars.
I'm going to pick a nit here for a moment. The #4 is a smoothing plane. It's for putting the final finished surface on a piece of work. I use mine (a type 9, built around 1902-07) on all kinds of projects. The #5 is the jack plane (usually the first plane that touches the surface.) Read every gory detail on this site: http://www.supertool.com/StanleyBG/stan0a.html
Now, I totally agree with Beetlejuice that a vintage plane is the way to go. Sure, the Lie-Neilsen tools are great, but they come with that hefty price tag (way out of my range.) Use the above link to read about the years you want to look for. Bench planes (which could easily radius a fretboard) were best before WWII. Block planes (which will also be fine at that job as well as many smaller tasks) were good for a little longer. Usually, you can tell by the paint job (again, reference the site above.) I'd get the adjustable mouth on the block plane (either 9 1/2 or 16) as that lets you take a really fine shaving.
Patrick (yet again, the link above) sells vintage tools. If you drop him a line and tell him your budget and needs, he'll probably have one on hand.
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