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Fret Board Thickness

Hey all. I have another question to throw at ya.

What is the thickness of wood that most of you use for a fret board?

I have been having a little trouble getting some frets into 6 mm pieces of wood, but have no problems with 9 mm pieces of wood or thicker. The best wood that I can find here in Japan is Japanese cedar. When I try to knock the frets in with a hammer, it just bounces off (they don't go in at all).

I would like to use the thinner wood due to over thickness of the neck plus the fret board. I would glue the fret board to the neck, but if I F-up, then I am stuck with a mistake.

I know many of you are thinking, why not just cut down the neck, right? Well, I am trying to cut out the time to make the guitars. Oh, and I would rather not nail the frets directly into the neck.

Any suggestions? What are some of your techniques for getting those frets in the board?

As always, thanks in advance for all of your help.

Douglas

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Permalink Reply by Skeesix on November 1, 2010 at 1:28am

6 mm is about 1/4" which is pretty standard for guitars. Cedar seems like it would be a little soft. Hard wood is normally used for fretboards.

The real trick is getting the fret slots to the right width. Too narrow, and you'll have trouble getting them in. Too wide and they'll be loose, requiring you to glue them in. However, some people do this on purpose as a technique.

As far as hammering, I start at an edge, not in the middle. The hammering should actually be more like tapping, if the fret slots are right.

If you have a curved fret board, the frets should also be curved.

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Permalink Reply by Randy Webb on November 1, 2010 at 2:42am

Im having trouble understanding why the thickness of wood matters?

If you cut the proper width slot for the frets, it shouldn't matter if the would is 6mm or 100mm thick the fret should go in. Does your saw width match the proper width for the fret ?

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Permalink Reply by Bluesheart on November 1, 2010 at 12:43pm

Take a look in my photos of my fret press, works really well and requires no hammering. I use 1/4 in stock for fingerboards, I think that is about 6mm?

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Permalink Reply by Bluesheart on November 1, 2010 at 1:09pm

http://www.cigarboxnation.com/photo/frettool-full

Sorry, I do not know how to just post the pic here from my page:(

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Permalink Reply by Douglas Eric Marsalis on November 1, 2010 at 2:11pm

Of course I am cutting a slot.

Turkish said:

Hang on ... are you even cutting a slot?

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Permalink Reply by Douglas Eric Marsalis on November 1, 2010 at 2:15pm

I have tried several saw widths. The one that is rec. by the nation is the one that I am having trouble with as far as hammering (tapping) due to the thickness of the board. If I use a thick piece of wood, no problem. If I use the 6mm, problem.

Randy Webb said:

Im having trouble understanding why the thickness of wood matters?

If you cut the proper width slot for the frets, it shouldn't matter if the would is 6mm or 100mm thick the fret should go in. Does your saw width match the proper width for the fret ?

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Permalink Reply by Douglas Eric Marsalis on November 1, 2010 at 2:17pm

Unfortunately, Japan does not have very many options as far as wood available (at least in my neck of the woods). The wood that they have seems to be in the middle ground for hardness. I really wish I had more options, but I do not.

Skeesix said:

6 mm is about 1/4" which is pretty standard for guitars. Cedar seems like it would be a little soft. Hard wood is normally used for fretboards.

The real trick is getting the fret slots to the right width. Too narrow, and you'll have trouble getting them in. Too wide and they'll be loose, requiring you to glue them in. However, some people do this on purpose as a technique.

As far as hammering, I start at an edge, not in the middle. The hammering should actually be more like tapping, if the fret slots are right.

If you have a curved fret board, the frets should also be curved.

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Permalink Reply by Douglas Eric Marsalis on November 1, 2010 at 2:19pm

Thanks for all of the replies. I will have to play around some more with what I have. I was hoping to get some techniques from folks besides what is most used. Perhaps some new techniques that most have not heard of. Thanks everyone.

D

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Permalink Reply by Randy Webb on November 1, 2010 at 2:19pm

The slot is the same size no matter what thickness the wood is if your using the same saw? Right?

Douglas Eric Marsalis said:

I have tried several saw widths. The one that is rec. by the nation is the one that I am having trouble with as far as hammering (tapping) due to the thickness of the board. If I use a thick piece of wood, no problem. If I use the 6mm, problem.

Randy Webb said:
Im having trouble understanding why the thickness of wood matters?

If you cut the proper width slot for the frets, it shouldn't matter if the would is 6mm or 100mm thick the fret should go in. Does your saw width match the proper width for the fret ?

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Permalink Reply by Douglas Eric Marsalis on November 1, 2010 at 2:44pm

Perhaps it is my technique (really shitty) in trying to knock the frets in. I will try again later in the day. I know that this is easier than what I am making of it. I will probably look back on this and say, damn what the hell was I thinking.

Randy Webb said:

The slot is the same size no matter what thickness the wood is if your using the same saw? Right?

Douglas Eric Marsalis said:
I have tried several saw widths. The one that is rec. by the nation is the one that I am having trouble with as far as hammering (tapping) due to the thickness of the board. If I use a thick piece of wood, no problem. If I use the 6mm, problem.

Randy Webb said:
Im having trouble understanding why the thickness of wood matters?

If you cut the proper width slot for the frets, it shouldn't matter if the would is 6mm or 100mm thick the fret should go in. Does your saw width match the proper width for the fret ?

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Permalink Reply by Jason W. on November 1, 2010 at 3:41pm

I'm by no means an expert on the matter, but the only problem I can think of that wood thickness would cause is extra reverberation in the wood from the tapping. A thinner piece of wood won't absorb force as well and can cause frets to pop out if the fretboard bounces around too much.

I would go lighter on the tapping if possible and be careful to keep the wire in place and set firm in the groove while you tap it. You might also try holding one side down and tap one end of the fret in, then slowly work across to the other. I also typically leave the fret pieces on the whole length and then snip them off after I put them in, that gives a nice long piece to hold on to and is easier to find if it happens to fly off into oblivion.

As stated above, you CAN always glue them in. The last fretboard I made I had two snafus with my fret saw on and wound up gluing them in. Seems to work alright.

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Permalink Reply by Mungo Park on November 1, 2010 at 6:09pm

If hammering them in does not work then try pressing them in with a clamp and a block of wood, or hammer with a block of wood on top.
When I worked at the railway the thinking was force it if it breaks it needed replacing anyways, H E double hockey stick of a way to run a railway, anyways you are not building a box car it is a cigar box guitar. Stop hammering and try something else. No maple around their, maybe try gluing on Bamboo enamel side up.
Cheers Ron.