Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Mungo Park on January 15, 2011 at 3:44pm

Maple with a oak strip down the middle, use light strings.

                            Cheers Ron

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Permalink Reply by Bob Harrison on January 15, 2011 at 4:36pm

Tal,

C.F. Martin guitars have used I think a  1/2 inch  square steel tubing for a non adjustable truss rod for years. This I feel would be an easy thing to install, and should give you years of good service. I have built guitar necks with this as well.

Also Harmony, Dobro, Regal, Stella guitars have used a 1/8 x 1/2 inch non adjustable steel bar.

 

I don't think a 6 string neck without a steel rod would last a long time, but I have been wrong before.

 

Hope this helps

Bob:)

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Permalink Reply by The Phrygian Kid on January 15, 2011 at 5:15pm

i'd use whatever i got for free, just so long as its strong hardwood, and i'd definitely laminate it.  At least 3 pieces, plus a fingerboard.

And id carve it nice and chunky, 50s style..

plenty of guitars have been made with no rod, dont believe the hype!

also, btw.. a truss rod does not add strength, it actually diminishes it by virtue of the wood it requires you to remove.  What it gives you back is adjustment.. so you can crank some relief back in when the tension bends it.

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Permalink Reply by Glaze on January 15, 2011 at 11:29pm

Very tough question and most guitar manufacturers have asked the very same thing.  Most six string guitars ever built have some kind of truss rod because wood bends under the string pressure.  Martin used mahogany necks (mahogany is a very stable wood)  with a t-bar truss rod in the early days and later on they used a square hollow bar.  The t-bar was stiffer and is regarded as better than the square hollow bar used later on.  Gibson and Fender have used the traditional truss rod which has proven to be extremely reliable and it sounds good too.  

 

If I had to make a neck without a truss rod I would use quarter sawn seasoned wood and use a laminate of different woods together.  I would also make the neck thick and fat because that would make it stronger.  

 

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Permalink Reply by Outhouse Instruments on January 16, 2011 at 12:23am

This is wrong. A steel or aluminum rod, square or whatever, is stronger then wood. Yes you remove wood, but the rod adds more strength than what the removed wood had. Yes the strength sometimes comes through tension, but it is still strength.

 

I do agree that if you did it w/out a truss rod, it should be big and chunky.

But, IMHO, I wouldn't do a six-er w/out a truss rod.

 

AFKAM

 

Jef Long said:

 

And id carve it nice and chunky, 50s style..

plenty of guitars have been made with no rod, dont believe the hype!

also, btw.. a truss rod does not add strength, it actually diminishes it by virtue of the wood it requires you to remove.  What it gives you back is adjustment.. so you can crank some relief back in when the tension bends it.

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Permalink Reply by rockcity on January 16, 2011 at 4:36am

I made a six string with a red oak neck and fingerboard about 4 years ago and have not had any problems with bowing yet.

It is a chunkier style neck..

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Permalink Reply by Huntz Meyer on January 16, 2011 at 4:59am

White ash works for me, with a fretboard glued on as a lamination.  Plenty strong and doesn't need to be excessively chunky.

Huntz

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Permalink Reply by ChickenboneJohn on January 16, 2011 at 5:54am

The concept of installing a fixed steel bar in a neck is quite different to installing an adjustable trussrod.  The trussrod adds adjustability, not strength. Depending on how deep the trussrod is installed below the fretboard, it tends to be on the compression side of the neck, or roughly along the neutral axis (the centre of the depth) of the neck. It's not there to add any strength, but to be able to counteract the tendancy of the strings to bend the neck, or in the case of a double-acting rod, it can also counter back-bow due to movement of the timber itself.  The closer the trussrod is buried in the centre of the neck (ie the neutral axis) the less contribution it has to adding overall stiffness to the neck.

 

A fixed, glued-in reinforcement such as a steel or carbon fibre bar, by creating what is in effect a composite structure can result in a stiffer neck, the downside is there's no adjustability to be able to tweek the relief in the neck.  Laminating the neck with a really stiff centre section of timber can also help, By keeping the neck pretty deep (structurally you are increasing the sectional modulus by going for a deeper neck), and the old-timey "vee" necks are an example of this.

This is wrong. A steel or aluminum rod, square or whatever, is stronger then wood. Yes you remove wood, but the rod adds more strength than what the removed wood had. Yes the strength sometimes comes through tension, but it is still strength.

 

I do agree that if you did it w/out a truss rod, it should be big and chunky.

But, IMHO, I wouldn't do a six-er w/out a truss rod.

 

AFKAM

 

Jef Long said:

 

And id carve it nice and chunky, 50s style..

plenty of guitars have been made with no rod, dont believe the hype!

also, btw.. a truss rod does not add strength, it actually diminishes it by virtue of the wood it requires you to remove.  What it gives you back is adjustment.. so you can crank some relief back in when the tension bends it.

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Permalink Reply by Don Thompson on January 16, 2011 at 6:57am

Excellent discussion, many good points have been made so I won't repeat except to say upright basses have no metal in the necks, however they are quite thick. The preferred wood of choice has been maple, and rock maple over other types. So I think one could safely build a neck from any hardwood and not have problems. The orginal Klein electric guitars used a solid rosewood neck, also thick. That aside, I have small hands and prefer some relief in my necks, so it's adjustable for me.

Don

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Permalink Reply by Mungo Park on January 16, 2011 at 7:57am

"also, btw.. a truss rod does not add strength, it actually diminishes it by virtue of the wood it requires you to remove.  What it gives you back is adjustment.. so you can crank some relief back in when the tension bends it."

 I am in this camp, truss rod does not add strength.

 It will also weaken the point where the neck meets the peg head, and if the guitar gets dropped and lands on the peg head, which it easily does as it is angled back, this weak point, right where the nut goes, will break easier than without a truss rod.

                                                                Cheers Ron.

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Permalink Reply by ChickenboneJohn on January 16, 2011 at 8:22am

It doesn't remove much strength in the neck, as the rod is pretty close the the centre of the neck, the neutral axis wheres there's actually no bending stress (no compression or tension)..but as you say, if there's a rout at the headstock for adjusting it, that does weaken it. Gibsons are notorious for headstock breaks because of using relatively weak mahogany (as opposed to maple) and that big hole they cut out for adjusting the trussrod.

Mungo Park said:

"also, btw.. a truss rod does not add strength, it actually diminishes it by virtue of the wood it requires you to remove.  What it gives you back is adjustment.. so you can crank some relief back in when the tension bends it."

 I am in this camp, truss rod does not add strength.

 It will also weaken the point where the neck meets the peg head, and if the guitar gets dropped and lands on the peg head, which it easily does as it is angled back, this weak point, right where the nut goes, will break easier than without a truss rod.

                                                                Cheers Ron.

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Permalink Reply by tal bluver on January 16, 2011 at 11:17am

thank you all for the replys!

I thought of this disscussion becuase-

1- i'm quite lazy :)

2- I have an electric guitar "stagg rock G" & I don't think it has a struss rod.

what do you think the wood is?



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