Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Brian Lemin on July 29, 2009 at 1:50am

It all depends on what you want from your CBG.
I am theoretically big on an acoustic CBG and have thought and written on the subject quite a lot; (see "Wot no articles") so if what you want is a good acoustic CBG then there are things (rules?) you can do that will probably enable you to make a pretty good sounding acoustic CBG.

If you are going to amplify it then frankly the rules are totally bendable and what becomes important is your pick up, possibly pre amp, and your amplifier. The rest of the design could probably be solid as are modern electric guitars.

Whilst a lot of CBG makers use various home made or commercial under string pick ups, the "real?" CBG guy uses a Piezo as a "pick up". ( Not really a rule but majority practice)

Though i am an experienced instrument maker i am very inexperienced in CBG making, but i have come to the personal opinion that the CBG lends itself very well to the addition of a resonator, it is rather poor as a purely acoustic instrument, but sounds just great amplified.

Lots of makers make very wonderful models of CBGs, superb craftsmanship, what looks to be good acoustics and very nice amplification, many make what would be great actual 6 string guitars from cigar boxes. Personally I do not go down that track as I see a CBG as a cheap, easy to make, easy to play, almost "folk" instrument, and while some folk enjoy the sophisticated approach others want a nice noisy, twangy blues/gospel three (perhaps 4) stringer.

I think the "no Rules" means "make what you want to make" and if it is a special sound you want then there may well be helpful guidelines (rules/) out there to help you

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Permalink Reply by Wes "I'm Baaaaack" Yates on July 29, 2009 at 2:04am

I have to agree with Brian 100%+

Rule #1 (if you will) -- Make what you are happy with.
Rule #2 -- In all cases of doubt, refer to rule #1

I think all of us make our second, third, etc in order to improve on our initial design, solve prior problems and see if we can "make it better" in order to produce an instrument that is not only aesthetically nice but sounds good. You will also see on this site folks who make the most simple CBG and love 'em. Nothing at all wrong with that. In fact, my next one (for my mom) will be a simple acoustic -- unless she wants frets and a pickup.

I do think there are cases where one can deviate too far from what a CBG is in its essence tho. What classifies an instrument as a CBG? Who knows where that barrier is. I don't.

-Wes

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Permalink Reply by Roosterman on July 29, 2009 at 2:43am

Well, I think the other guys have pretty much covered it!

For me too, No Rules means just that - No Rules. But I do have my preferences, and every guitar has some essential components - strings, tuners etc - but there is more than one way to skin a cat, and thats what its about. Coming up with different ideas, new solutions, and challenging ya self.

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Permalink Reply by Hip Bone Bellaire on July 29, 2009 at 3:20am

Wes Yates --- I have to go with RULE #2

Rule #1 (if you will) -- Make what you are happy with.
Rule #2 -- In all cases of doubt, refer to rule #1

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Permalink Reply by Mark Werner on July 29, 2009 at 4:13am

I'm currently building a "solid-body-electric" cigar box. I've already pulled the guts out of a cheap Strat "Squier" and obtained the box.
Why? It's cool.... At least to me. Just seemed part of the challenge of building. I'm using the stock neck for one reason only...The truss rod. I wanted a skinny, slick "electric" neck, and building one without a rod is tempting fate.
Building one with a rod is rather challenging without a router and other advanced woodworking tools.

So, steal a pre-made neck and go to it. Still plenty of creativity to go around; it'll be a "semi-acoustic", after all, and I stil have to worry about neck alignment and pickup placement and bridge height and all those other things.

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Permalink Reply by One String Willie on July 29, 2009 at 4:43am

Hi Craig-

This is definitely a philosophical question! I am not a philosopher, but I have thought quite a bit about this.

I interpret the "No Rules" rule in this way: there are basically no rules to making or playing a homemade instrument other than the rules you set for yourself. This means that at some point, you might want to spend some time thinking about your own personal esthetic--the limits you set on yourself that give meaning to what you make and how you play.

For me, this means that for the CBG components, I use factory-made tuners (but really, really cheap), store-bought strings, and (if the CBG has frets, store-bought fret wire). All the rest of the components are things that were not originally intended to be used as a component of a musical instrument.

My esthetic applies to tools as well: I built my first CBG using a drill as the only power tool, and the others have had a band-saw added to the power tool lineup. My diddley bows are made with a circular saw to cut the 2x4s to length, and all the rest is done with hand tools.

My CBG pickups are all piezos, and the diddley bows started out with piezos. I made my own electromagnetic pickup, winding the magnet wire on a sewing machine bobbin, and then purchased two diddley bow pickups from Ted Crocker. However, shortly after getting them, I realized that these pickups, as great as they sound, went against my self-imposed "build it yourself from non-musical components" esthetic, and I have since been using only my home-made sewing machine bobbin pickups. Ted's excellent pickups are in my back-up box, as emergency spares.

With regard to playing, my repertoire has an eye on tradition, but my playing technique has very few limits. That said, while I do use a guitar pick or finger picks and home-made bottleneck slide for the CBGs or CBDBs, for the lap-style diddley bows I use items that are not sold as components of musical instruments--so no e-bows for me.

To sum up, the "rules" I go by are limits I have set for myself to establish an esthetic. I judge myself by these rules, but I try not to judge others by them. When I am looking at or listening to another person's work, I do try to discern if they have set limits for themselves in order for me to understand the context in which they are working. Finally, I should mention that if I see that I need to change my own personal rules, I will do so, but only after considerable thought.

Best regards, Willie

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Permalink Reply by Diane in Chicago on July 29, 2009 at 5:07am

I wrestle with this idea, too. Just in the last couple of weeks I purchased 'real' fretwire -- which my daughter pointed out "goes against everything a CBG stands for!"

But I was sending guitars into high-use, low-lovin' environments (summer camps and schools) where frets popping off was going to be a problem (as was just proven to me this weekend, when a guitar was returned with a ton of frets off.) So this is a concession I think I had to make.

So my "real" list grew : tuners, strings, fretwire. But there I stand firm, the rest must be scavenged, re-purposed, rustled up.

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Permalink Reply by Jkevn on July 29, 2009 at 6:42am

I cannot say it any better than One String Willie did. There is a certain "sumthin" about CBG's that grabbed you when the affliction first started to set in. It may be the homemade thing, maybe the sound, the found object aspect, or even a love of the cigar box design/labels.
Whatever the "sumthing" that drew you in...it will show in the type of builds you create. I personally have no interest in CBG's with "real" guitar necks, pups, etc. but I do not rule the Nation and noone has to care what I like. If I don't like your build, it doesn't change it's sound to your ear nor it's beauty in your eye.
For me (at this very moment) I like 3 strings max, Hand-made neck, piezo pups and only the essential parts (tuners etc.) coming from commercial sources. The REASON you build will have an influence as well. I don't build to sell, I build to give to friends and family that play. The smile when they realize that tailpiece is a hinge, or those frets are copper wire is where the enjoyment comes for me....when it makes music.....thats like a dog sticking his head out the car window....you will only understand it when it happens to you.


Disclaimer- My opinions do not reflect the opinions of the Nation or even other members of the Nation. In fact sometimes, perhaps the result of a personality quirk, the opinions I express may not even reflect my actual opinion, But may be expressed to spur debate or discussion. I have been known to engage in recreational arguments.

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Permalink Reply by Hip Bone Bellaire on July 29, 2009 at 6:58am

I've just seen these guys in Rochester and their Guitars a made from Mufflers... Actually very nice and refreshing...
Homemade Jamz Blues Band
http://www.myspace.com/homemadejamzbluesband

Lead is 16
Bass is 15 and drums are 10 years old

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Permalink Reply by toasterburn on July 29, 2009 at 8:03am

there are a few firm rules... like you should absolutely not make a guitar out of jello.

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Permalink Reply by One String Willie on July 29, 2009 at 8:38am

Craig, thanks again for starting this thread!

This is fairly closely related to the questions of "why would someone want to make and play a home made instrument," "what makes a CBG or other home made instrument different from a store-bought instrument," "what can you learn from teaching yourself to build and/or play a home made instrument," "what meaning does making or playing a CBG have for you?"

It would be a good idea to each of us to spend a little time thinking about these things. There will be a point where someone will ask you one of these questions. It may be a friend, an acquaintance, or a reporter from the local paper looking for a feature article. These in fact are exactly the kinds of questions reporters ask, and if they don't ask them, you can pose them as rhetorical questions. If you have thought about it beforehand, you will have a well articulated answer to provide.

Shane used to have a series of CBG propaganda lessons, and the series convinced me I needed to think about these things. We need to have him post this somewhere again (it probably is posted somewhere--I just don't know where).

Thanks also to the folks who have provided some extremely varied, but thoughtful, responses!

Best regards, Willie

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Permalink Reply by Wil Rogers on July 29, 2009 at 9:48am

My attraction to the cigar box guitar is that it completes an artistic loop within itself. Imagine a couple hundred years ago, artist were mixing berries (and things) with egg yolks to create their paint, they made the frames and stretched the canvass. The painting is only the performance on the 'stage' the artist created.

I haven't made my CBG yet. (Trying to get some fretwire together, and waiting for my ebay tuners). If somebody has an old guitar neck laying around and wants to throw it on the guitar that's not a 'fancy CBG', in my opinion it's recycling. I'd say that a cbg could be built for about 25 dollars. That's 15 for the tuners, 8 for the box, 2 for the piezo. . . . I would think a humbucker model CBG could be built for less than 50?

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