Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by tal bluver on January 16, 2011 at 11:20am

well I can tell you that the body is mahogany & also the neck

the fretboard is rosewood.

don't know though if it has a trussrod...

tal bluver said:

thank you all for the replys!

I thought of this disscussion becuase-

1- i'm quite lazy :)

2- I have an electric guitar "stagg rock G" & I don't think it has a struss rod.

what do you think the wood is?



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Permalink Reply by Don Thompson on January 16, 2011 at 12:12pm

this is a Gibson SG knock off clone. It most definetly has a adjustable truss rod. Look at the headstock, see three screws, remove the screws and the trianglular plastic piece and you will find a nut to adjust the neck.

Don

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Permalink Reply by Bob Harrison on January 16, 2011 at 6:31pm

ChickenboneJohn said:

The concept of installing a fixed steel bar in a neck is quite different to installing an adjustable trussrod.  The trussrod adds adjustability, not strength. Depending on how deep the trussrod is installed below the fretboard, it tends to be on the compression side of the neck, or roughly along the neutral axis (the centre of the depth) of the neck. It's not there to add any strength, but to be able to counteract the tendancy of the strings to bend the neck, or in the case of a double-acting rod, it can also counter back-bow due to movement of the timber itself.  The closer the trussrod is buried in the centre of the neck (ie the neutral axis) the less contribution it has to adding overall stiffness to the neck.

 

A fixed, glued-in reinforcement such as a steel or carbon fibre bar, by creating what is in effect a composite structure can result in a stiffer neck, the downside is there's no adjustability to be able to tweek the relief in the neck.  Laminating the neck with a really stiff centre section of timber can also help, By keeping the neck pretty deep (structurally you are increasing the sectional modulus by going for a deeper neck), and the old-timey "vee" necks are an example of this.

This is wrong. A steel or aluminum rod, square or whatever, is stronger then wood. Yes you remove wood, but the rod adds more strength than what the removed wood had. Yes the strength sometimes comes through tension, but it is still strength.

 

I do agree that if you did it w/out a truss rod, it should be big and chunky.

But, IMHO, I wouldn't do a six-er w/out a truss rod.

 

AFKAM

 

Jef Long said:

 

And id carve it nice and chunky, 50s style..

plenty of guitars have been made with no rod, dont believe the hype!

also, btw.. a truss rod does not add strength, it actually diminishes it by virtue of the wood it requires you to remove.  What it gives you back is adjustment.. so you can crank some relief back in when the tension bends it.

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Permalink Reply by ChickenboneJohn on January 16, 2011 at 9:17pm

Yes, that volute certainly adds strength, but I believe it's a vestigial feature of how headstocks used to be joined, with a rather fiddley "vee" and shoulder joint..on a lot of 18th C guitars the headstocks weren't scarfed, but had a joint which sort of followed the shape of that vee and the "shoulders".

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Permalink Reply by The Phrygian Kid on January 17, 2011 at 2:03am

Volutes are sexy, u dont need a truss rod to get all pervy back there, thats a secret place ;)

 

btw, bottom one is a 6 string trussrodless neck, made from unknown packing wood from a crate from China

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Permalink Reply by ChickenboneJohn on January 17, 2011 at 4:49am

 

Here's an example of that "inserted vee" joint on a Panormo repro...you can see exactly where that Martin volute came from..even tho' they might have stopped using the joint itself.

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Permalink Reply by carverman on January 17, 2011 at 5:13am

If you are building a 6 string, the string tension even with light strings is considerable.  

Going by the various string sets from the D'Addario website, adding the individual string tensions,

 one can expect 103lbs of neck tension for guages 10-46 (light),

129lbs for guages 11-52 (medium) and 148 lbs for guages 12-54.  

So even with a light set on your CBG neck, constant tension could eventually cause some bowing. 

However, if your action is high to begin with, then the bowing may not be too serious to

 cause fret buzz.

 

Using a better quality wood such as quarter sawn, over flat sawn, where the wood grain growth rings are

"on end" vs flat sawn will help to prevent normal  cupping of the wood.

 Martin and other manufacturers use quarter sawn mahogany in their necks for stability.   

Fender uses maple, which is properly seasoned,  Hard maple  properly seasoned is very stable.

 

As far as a wood strip, you need to laminate the neck with a hard piece of  wood in the middle,

at least a 1/4 inch and perferably a bit wider.  Usually hard maple can be used for this strip in most guitars,

 but the steel bar or tube, as Bob is  suggesting is good insurance against neck warping.

 I'm using one of these Martin style square steel tubes on my next build.  

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Permalink Reply by Bob Harrison on January 17, 2011 at 5:32am

Wow, I like that !!! Could you show us how you made it.


ChickenboneJohn said:

 

Here's an example of that "inserted vee" joint on a Panormo repro...you can see exactly where that Martin volute came from..even tho' they might have stopped using the joint itself.

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Permalink Reply by Josh Gayou (SmokehouseGuitars) on January 17, 2011 at 2:26pm

Laminate two or three pieces of wood together lengthwise and you can get away with not using a truss rod.  The changing grain directions should be good.  If you have the tools then the best way to do it is to rip one large piece into three long pieces, run them flat on a joiner, and then glue them together with the middle piece in the reverse direction.  Changes the grain direction and relieves all the stress and tension that the wood is naturally carrying.

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Permalink Reply by Jason on January 18, 2011 at 5:38am

I rout a channel in the neck and fit a rectangular piece of carbon fiber as a support prior to gluing down the fretboard.

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Permalink Reply by Bob Harrison on January 18, 2011 at 9:51am

I purchased an old 6 string, D size mid 1970’s Korean guitar for the neck . The neck will be used for a pattern for my duplicator machine “Big Green“.


Please note this neck has both an adjustable truss rod and an alloy channel. I guess it’s like wearing a belt and suspenders at the same time. After all these years the neck was as straight as an arrow, it appears the alloy channel and adjustable truss rod was the best of both worlds.

Cheers
Bob

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Permalink Reply by Don Thompson on January 18, 2011 at 10:13am

Bob, That style of truss rod has been around awhile. Jon copied one here:http://pluto.spaceports.com/~fishbake/lpc/truss/trusr.htm

I look forward to seeing what you do with the neck.

Don

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