Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by HENRY LOWMAN on November 6, 2010 at 5:44pm

PATIENCE...is a virtue...LOL! Actually, I've had the same problem. It gets better with practice (though I STILL find myself always tweaking them a bit...LOL!).

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Permalink Reply by Mister Scott on November 6, 2010 at 5:47pm

HENRY LOWMAN said:

PATIENCE...is a virtue...LOL! Actually, I've had the same problem. It gets better with practice (though I STILL find myself always tweaking them a bit...LOL!).

I know, i know... :-) But here's why I bring it up to the Nation: with each build, I learn from my mistakes so I can move on to slightly more challenging things with each successive build. It works in every area except fretwork, where it seems my skills are constantly in stasis....

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Permalink Reply by Diane in Chicago on November 6, 2010 at 6:20pm

Have you watched that video by Darren Dukes? He made it for me back when he was trying to convince me to use real fretwire. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7z9_pr7ntwk

Are you using a proper fret saw? If not, maybe your slots are different depths and therefore uneven. I only ever have had to fix a wonky one here and there.



Scotty C. said:

HENRY LOWMAN said:

PATIENCE...is a virtue...LOL! Actually, I've had the same problem. It gets better with practice (though I STILL find myself always tweaking them a bit...LOL!).

I know, i know... :-) But here's why I bring it up to the Nation: with each build, I learn from my mistakes so I can move on to slightly more challenging things with each successive build. It works in every area except fretwork, where it seems my skills are constantly in stasis....

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Permalink Reply by Shawn on November 6, 2010 at 6:25pm

Give us a rundown of your fretting actions

Mine is at cut all fret slots to just a bit deeper than the "tang" of the fret. 2 starting at bottom of neck install frets up till I reach the nut on neck. 3 tape off fret board in between frets. 4 level plain frets to same level. 5 bevel ends to 35 deg. 7 mark the tops of all frets with a sharpie and check level once move by leveling remark spots that got filed off start crowning with file then sand paper 120 , 220 , 320 then steel wool till they are nice and shinny the tape should be looked at at all stages for damage and repaired as needed. Once done resisted the need to take tape off and install both E strings or outer strings (top & bottom ) check action at this time with strings and a long ruler in the middle for fret level. I keep two old E strings just for this hate using new strings during setup stage. I try to keep the tape on through the stain and clear coat stage as well then I'll I have to tape off is the fret to fret end down the neck and I have dubble tape on my nice clean fret board and shinny frets. Damn I talk alot. Sorry

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Permalink Reply by Outhouse Instruments on November 7, 2010 at 1:19am

Fretwork starts BEFORE you reach for the wire and clippers.
If using a fretboard or not, the face of the neck must be flat and square. Even more so ( almost perfect, if not better) if you are not using a fretboard.
The fretboard needs to be square and as perfectly flat as possible. AND a consistent thickness.
The slot has to be deep enough for the the tang on the fret to seat without bottoming out.
One thing I see myself doing, is a very slight (microscopic even) bend in the wire when tapping them in. The edges end up too high .... needs leveling and dressing.
The funny thing is, the better my builds get, the more I have to work at the frets. Just a plain oak stick neck ..... 9 times out of 10, no troubles. Laminated neck, fretboard, etc. .... more fretwork.


Matt

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Permalink Reply by Mister Scott on November 7, 2010 at 3:20am

Does everyone tap the frets in? I use Josh Gayou's advice and press them into the slots with my Irwin Clamps...

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Permalink Reply by Diane in Chicago on November 7, 2010 at 3:24am

I use a plastic-faced hammer, and clamp the neck to the worksurface. And the key is to "tap", not to whallop. And I know they are fully seated when you can't even slip a fingernail under the lip of the fret. But I've got thin girly fingernails, so that rule might not be of much help for you bigger, more manly builders.




Scotty C. said:

Does everyone tap the frets in? I use Josh Gayou's advice and press them into the slots with my Irwin Clamps...

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Permalink Reply by Mark Bliss on November 7, 2010 at 3:39am

I have placed some more tips in a thread dedicated to this subject here:

http://www.cigarboxnation.com/group/intermediatebuildingtipsandtric...

There is a companion discussion that contains tips on truing and finishing frets as well:

http://www.cigarboxnation.com/group/intermediatebuildingtipsandtric...

I may incorporate both threads into one at some point, as they are so closely related, we will see.

*I dont want to take anything away from the Building Secrets, Tips, Advice, Discussion group, just thought there might be a need for separate discussions as this group has gotten pretty vast in size and scope, and the same FAQ's seem to keep popping up. Good answers always are forthcoming but finding them by searching hundreds of pages has become difficult at times. (At least for me)
Anyway, just trying to build on a great thing here!

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Permalink Reply by Wes "I'm Baaaaack" Yates on November 7, 2010 at 3:51am

I would add, but darn, everyone here has said it all. Scotty, heed their advice.

-WY

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Permalink Reply by BadTimmy on November 7, 2010 at 3:17pm

Having made my reputation with the bar bands in my area specifically doing fretwork, here are some things to consider.
1) When you initially cut your fret wire, are you inspecting each piece for straightness?
2) Ensure that you are cutting the slot for correct compression of the fret tang.
3) I almost always glue in my frets using only Titebond. Why? If a fret ever needs to be replaced, it's very easy to remove.
4) I never need more than a cursory/minimal fret leveling procedure. Why? I check fret to fret as I install them.
5) Always check the fingerboard surface for parallelism. What is this? Square down through the fretting surface and level from bass to treble sides.
6) Re-crowning/dressing is an earned artistry. Whether you are crowning, dressing, or beveling frets...use 1 hand only. I bevel fret ends with a triple bevel using about 4 strokes toward the nut, 4 strokes toward the bridge.
7) If your fret heights vary "wildly", you are pressing them in much too forcefully.
8) My final dressing is using 400grit, then 600grit wet-or-dry sandpaper with a final buff using Nevr-Dull polishing wadding, about 100 strokes per fret, 3 times. And yes, I count my polish strokes.

Hope this helps. As always, "You burn, you learn"

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Permalink Reply by Mister Scott on November 7, 2010 at 3:37pm

BadTimmy said:

Ensure that you are cutting the slot for correct compression of the fret tang.

By this, what do you mean? Do you men setting the depth-stop on my fret saw to the exact fret tang?

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Permalink Reply by BadTimmy on November 7, 2010 at 3:55pm

Scotty, almost all fret tangs have a cross-section approximately .023", the appropriate fret-saw should be about .025" which means the thickness of the "kerf" or the width of the cut the saw is creating. Too shallow of depth can cause the fret wire to "hump up", which is bad, too deep is usually not a problem. For a small investment, you can buy fret wire and a useful fretting DVD from G.B. Gitty for about $10.00. Even with all of my guitar building books and experience, I still obtained this from Gitty. You can never have too much info, and I found Gitty's DVD to be a useful, informative resource.

Check my page for my CBG#2 build pics, NO fret leveling, only end beveling and polishing.

Hang in there.

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